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#108373 - 01/09/17 05:39 AM iMac Classic?
KevinP Offline
Member

Registered: 06/17/09
Posts: 56
Has there been any thought to emulation the iMac 68000 or PPC versions?

I still have my old disks like OS8 and OS9

Was also thinking about my old Telstar Combat with the 4 joysticks coming out but it's fried.

Any suggestions?

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#108375 - 01/09/17 09:16 AM Re: iMac Classic? [Re: KevinP]
Vas Crabb Offline
Very Senior Member

Registered: 02/08/04
Posts: 1727
Loc: Sydney, Australia
There's no such thing as a 68k iMac. The first iMac used a PowerPC 750 CPU. MAME emulates a number of 68k Macs reasonably well, and there's been a little progress towards getting x100 PowerMacs to boot recently.

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#108377 - 01/09/17 05:53 PM Re: iMac Classic? [Re: Vas Crabb]
KevinP Offline
Member

Registered: 06/17/09
Posts: 56
My mistake, I was thinking about the correlation between when Amiga changed from 68x to PPC is when Apple did the same.

Now that YOU cleared that up can you answer the question or are we going to mix apple and oranges over the graphics chip.


Edited by KevinP (01/09/17 05:53 PM)

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#108378 - 01/09/17 06:58 PM Re: iMac Classic? [Re: KevinP]
Darkstar Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/19/05
Posts: 509
Loc: GERMANY
Originally Posted By KevinP
Now that YOU cleared that up can you answer the question or are we going to mix apple and oranges over the graphics chip.

What? He answered your question pretty well I think. Or did you want to know anything more specific? If so then you should rephrase your question to be more specific.

Also, nobody said anything about a graphics chip?

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#108379 - 01/09/17 07:17 PM Re: iMac Classic? [Re: KevinP]
R. Belmont Offline

Very Senior Member

Registered: 03/17/01
Posts: 15487
Loc: USA
Yeah, I'm a little confused. And while it seemed pretty transparent to end users, the switch from 68k to PowerPC in the 6100/7100/8100 was actually quite dramatic under the covers. Only the Intel transition in 2005 was crazier.

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#108380 - 01/09/17 08:52 PM Re: iMac Classic? [Re: KevinP]
KevinP Offline
Member

Registered: 06/17/09
Posts: 56
OK, then I will be more specific.

Is there any plans to create a PPC version of imac in MESS.
Notice I say MESS

I still contend that it was a 100 and 10% mistake to combine MESS and MAME which does nothing but turn 20,000 files into 40,000 that need maintaining.

No doubt that will cause an argument as big as BS reasons why Dragons Lair is not emulated on MAME.

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#108381 - 01/09/17 08:59 PM Re: iMac Classic? [Re: KevinP]
Darkstar Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/19/05
Posts: 509
Loc: GERMANY
There is no MESS anymore, it's all MAME now.

As Vas said, there is work going on on some of the x100 PowerMacs that were (obviously) PPC, so I'd guess at some point there will also be progress in the iMac emulation. But don't hold your breath, it might be some time until then.

But again it will all be in MAME, not in MESS, as MESS (as a standalone project) is dead as a parrot.

I'm sure others can tell you a lot more about what the progress is, what is done and what is still missing...

Also I don't know where you get the impression that merging MAME and MESS did nothing good. Ever read the commit logs? Many bugs were found that way because code reuse is good, even if you're 110% sure it isn't


Aaaaand, for the record, Dragon's Lair is emulated. I just launched "mame64.exe dlair" and it comes up (of course I'm missing the ROMs so I can't really say how well it works)


Edited by Darkstar (01/09/17 09:08 PM)

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#108384 - 01/09/17 09:30 PM Re: iMac Classic? [Re: KevinP]
R. Belmont Offline

Very Senior Member

Registered: 03/17/01
Posts: 15487
Loc: USA
Work is ongoing on PowerMacs, somewhat (the guy doing it refuses to keep me in the loop, which is problematic since I'm the Mac driver architect). The specific iMac is probably a ways off, but most of the iconic Mac games and ports worked well on the earlier PowerPC machines.

Note that when those machines work it'll be in MAME and there will be no possibility of backporting it, so your whining about that stuff doesn't matter.

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#108391 - 01/10/17 04:31 AM Re: iMac Classic? [Re: KevinP]
Vas Crabb Offline
Very Senior Member

Registered: 02/08/04
Posts: 1727
Loc: Sydney, Australia
Wow, talk about how to get people off-side. You're far more likely to get blown off with sarcastic answers than anything with that attitude.

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#108397 - 01/11/17 06:03 AM Re: iMac Classic? [Re: KevinP]
Heihachi_73 Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 08/30/02
Posts: 330
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
Originally Posted By KevinP
OK, then I will be more specific.

Is there any plans to create a PPC version of imac in MESS.
Notice I say MESS

I still contend that it was a 100 and 10% mistake to combine MESS and MAME which does nothing but turn 20,000 files into 40,000 that need maintaining.

No doubt that will cause an argument as big as BS reasons why Dragons Lair is not emulated on MAME.
The iMac series will be added when someone dumps everything on a board. It needs more than just a BIOS image and install discs. The beige G3 Mac would most likely be the starting point for emulation before MAME moves across to the iMac. The first step is to dump everything possible on the board and submit everything to MAME to be added to a skeleton driver. "I'm a PC," so hopefully it isn't too different, but MAME won't get far with just a BIOS image and Mac OS install discs, it needs everything else, which depending on the hardware may even require a board to be donated and/or sacrificed for the greater good of emulation. I remember reading that Guru was given an iMac some time ago however, don't know which version it was.

Speaking of iDevices, the first iPod would be a worthy candidate for emulation these days.

As for the MAME/MESS merger, that actually reduced the amount of files between the two, as there was a lot of duplicated code (e.g. PlayChoice-10 in MAME and the NES/Famicom in MESS) and in some cases the emulation code was more complete in either MAME or MESS and left forgotten and outdated/incomplete/not working on the other side. MESS was MAME since the first release well over a decade ago, it just didn't have "arcade" machines and less people used it because it didn't support a feature or enhancement or speed-up hack that another emulator used (insert stereotypical PS1/N64 emulator here), or the systems didn't work properly or weren't even emulated at all. MESS was almost always treated as the last resort for emulating anything until it became one as UME and eventually MAME.

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