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#111122 - 10/19/17 05:41 PM Re: TMS-09xx/1xxx thread (was New Dumps) [Re: seanriddle]  
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Green House is pretty likely a Sharp SM510. It has a CPU, ROM, RAM, and LCD controller. Even if you disregard this 'polynomial generator', a Sharp SM510 isn't a collection of shift registers (LCD elements are via RAM). It doesn't have a sprite collision matrix either, nor is player movement on a matrix where logic can swap bits. Increased game speed is done with programming, not an increased clock (32khz always), player movement doesn't become faster when gameplay speed increases.

Even if they were well-meant logic guesses, you can't make a game with digital clock using those 'ingredients'.

#111123 - 10/19/17 05:57 PM Re: TMS-09xx/1xxx thread (was New Dumps) [Re: Just Desserts]  
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Originally Posted by Just Desserts
Didn't the Sharp SM5x series have an LFSR for its program counter? Could be the person just wildly mis-remembering it.


He specifically said "there is no MCU", which makes it a really wild mis-remember.

#111124 - 10/20/17 08:39 AM Re: TMS-09xx/1xxx thread (was New Dumps) [Re: ICEknight]  
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Originally Posted by ICEknight
Originally Posted by Rik
but Coleco Donkey Kong and Pac-Man are much easier... And you can make them geometrically perfect...
Wouldn't that be a bad thing, if the originals weren't geometrically perfect?

Also, even when some graphics are being repeated, they may be just slightly different... I think that (as in all the latest SVGs) even the small imperfections across things like the score counters' digits may be worth preserving, since that's how the real things look.


No, when looking at the VFDs under magnification, they are made pretty much perfectly, almost like a vector system was used to etch them (or however they are made). They are then sort of 'silk screened' to get the phosphorescent paint on them. This is what differs from VFD to VFD- the leaking or splattering of the paint. Technically, every VFD is different do to this painting process, and these imperfections can't really be seen when they are turned on unless you are looking at it very closely (unless it's a really bad one, which I have seen). Most of what you see with the naked eye is just the light 'blowing out' in your vision, or through the plastic.

When you scrape the paint off of them on a game like Pac-Man, every Pac-Man is identical (at least, identical enough to look identical under a simple magnifying glass...)

There are some VFDs where they aren't perfect thought. Some where half of the VFD is supposed to be a mirror image of the other half, but if you layer the two halves in Photoshop, they don't match (noticeably). Stuff like that I would leave as-is. But if the graphic is supposed to be a perfect square, and the only reason it isn't is because of the pain flowing a tiny bit when it was applied, I'd opt to make it a square.

#111125 - 10/20/17 04:18 PM Re: TMS-09xx/1xxx thread (was New Dumps) [Re: Rik]  
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Originally Posted by Rik
No, when looking at the VFDs under magnification, they are made pretty much perfectly, almost like a vector system was used to etch them (or however they are made). They are then sort of 'silk screened' to get the phosphorescent paint on them. This is what differs from VFD to VFD- the leaking or splattering of the paint. Technically, every VFD is different do to this painting process, and these imperfections can't really be seen when they are turned on unless you are looking at it very closely (unless it's a really bad one, which I have seen). Most of what you see with the naked eye is just the light 'blowing out' in your vision, or through the plastic.

When you scrape the paint off of them on a game like Pac-Man, every Pac-Man is identical (at least, identical enough to look identical under a simple magnifying glass...)

Ah ok, I was just assuming otherwise after seeing how common that kind of shape irregularities were in LCD displays.

Last edited by ICEknight; 10/20/17 04:32 PM.
#111136 - 10/23/17 07:23 AM Re: TMS-09xx/1xxx thread (was New Dumps) [Re: hap]  
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Originally Posted by hap
Nah, MP is the standard serial/productcode prefix for TI TMS1000 series MCUs.
My guess is TMS1170.

I haven't had time to decap it yet, but I removed it from the PCB and the silkscreen underneath it says 1170. But the pinout is different from any other TMS1xxx I've seen. I'm guessing that they needed more R outputs, so they put a TMS1370 into a 28-pin package and left off O2, O1 and O0 to make room for R11, R12 and R13. That would explain why the MP code is unusual.

#111156 - 10/25/17 01:37 PM Re: TMS-09xx/1xxx thread (was New Dumps) [Re: seanriddle]  
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MAME 0.191 is out, and continues to add new Tiger handhelds thanks to our anonymous donator and Sean.

REMINDER: All background artwork for the LCD games in the hh_sm510 driver is now external.
Here: http://tsk-tsk.net/net/extart/

For people unfamiliar with MAME external artwork: Just copy the zip file(s) to the artwork folder and MAME will automatically include the background gfx when you load one of these games.

#111177 - 10/28/17 02:40 AM Re: TMS-09xx/1xxx thread (was New Dumps) [Re: Rik]  
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Originally Posted by Rik
Originally Posted by seanriddle
A collector in Barcelona sent me a Gakken / LSI Invader 2000, AKA Cosmic Fire Away 3000 AKA Hanzawa Twinvader III. It's got a 28-pin SDIP MP1604 MSHL^8218 and a TMS1024. I haven't yet followed traces to see which variety of TMS1xxx that the MP1604 is. I haven't ever taken pics of a VFD for vectoring, either.


Wire all the leads of the VFD together so you can turn on all the elements, and then take two or 3 pictures either of lower voltages to the VFD, or different shutter rates. We want a nice, bright one to get good representation of the colors, and then some dimmer ones to eliminate the 'blow-out' of the shapes from the brightness...

And a large, really clear picture of it with no power would be helpful too, if someone wants to really go in and clean the vectors one graphic at a time...

These never Potrace very cleanly (that I've ever seen), but you can get a usable file from that (those are the 'needs redump' ones in MAME). Then going back in to clean them up to make them perfect. The ones I did I put really high resolution photos of the VFD turned off in the background of Inkscape and re-traced (or corrected) each sprite individually... A pain in the ass for games like Machine Man with no repeating graphics, but Coleco Donkey Kong and Pac-Man are much easier... And you can make them geometrically perfect... smile

I don't have time to try to vectorize these right now, but I posted pics of the VFD. There are a few powered ones, then a composite of 1250 pics I took with my microscope.
www.seanriddle.com/invaderiivfd.7z

#111187 - 10/28/17 06:17 PM Re: TMS-09xx/1xxx thread (was New Dumps) [Re: seanriddle]  
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Here's an svg for it. It still needs cleanup at the edges, can be done later. http://tsk-tsk.net/net/temp/invaderiivfdmicro3.svg

This is done with potrace, then getting rid of all the dot-sized segments in inkscape. Then colouring the segments, and doing a small amount of path simplify.

#111189 - 10/29/17 06:17 AM Re: TMS-09xx/1xxx thread (was New Dumps) [Re: seanriddle]  
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Originally Posted by seanriddle
then a composite of 1250 pics I took with my microscope.


Nice, I would love a picture like this of every VFD! Is this an automated process? I may send you a couple of VFDs if you are willing to take pics of them for me...

#111191 - 10/29/17 05:50 PM Re: TMS-09xx/1xxx thread (was New Dumps) [Re: seanriddle]  
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It took a few minutes to level the platform so that the whole display was in focus, but the picture taking is automated. It took about an hour to take the pics, then I scaled them down with BIMP and used FIJI to composite them. I used the lowest-power objective and relay lens on the microscope and the lowest resolution that the camera offers, but still scaled each pic down to 1/8 the original size before compositing. The resulting pic is about 4670 DPI.

I first scanned the VFD at 1200 DPI, but I can't control the focus with my scanner, and the grid was sharper than the paint. I took pics with my camera, but my camera stand isn't tall enough to get the entire VFD in one shot.

The active area of this VFD is about 1" x 3". I can go bigger, but have constraints on the range of motion and the size of what I can put under the scope. I had to remove the VFD from the PCB.

I could run 3 wires from the PCB to the VFD under the microscope to get pics with it lit up, but I'm not sure that's needed. I'm also not sure if it would be bright enough to photograph well.

I also played around with illuminating the VFD with a blacklight. A normal blacklight tube worked, but the display was dim. An LED blacklight flashlight made it a lot brighter, but couldn't light up the entire display at once.

I'd be happy to take some pics.

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