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(Analog) Joystick Compatibility & Callibration with MAME #20108 11/05/04 10:15 AM
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Integra Offline OP
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I bought a USB joystick/controller last week and I am having trouble being able to callibrate it with MacMAME. I am able to get some items to work, but control most items I cannot. The controller is a Game Elements by Gemini (USA) USB device, with a retractable cable that fits under the controller when the cable is not needed. I have been trying to locate an image of what the specific joystick looks like that I have, but haven't been able to find one. The page for Gemini USA can be found at http://www.gemini-usa.com/gemini/index.asp .

The controller that I have is very similar to this one made by Logitech:

Logitech Dual Action Game Pad USB
http://www.logitech.com/index.cfm/products/details/CA/EN,CRID=11,CONTENTID=6951

I noticed that it the controller that I have from Gemini USA is analog also, just like the one above from Logitech. Would this be the reason that I have been having trouble with callibration? I noticed specifically on the information page for the controller by Logitech, above, that it says,

"Play any kind of game with this versatile controller"

Is the controller that I have from Gemini USA different in some way that callibration would be different? Does anyone have an analog controller that is being used with MacMAME, and if so, what are the special steps that I need to follow to callibrate the controller? Or are analog controllers not compatible with MacMAME? I'm hoping someone can be of assistance. I found the controller at a really good price, and it is of good quality also.
In advance, thank you.

Re: (Analog) Joystick Compatibility & Callibration with MAME #20109 11/05/04 12:18 PM
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Brad Oliver Offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by Integra:
Is the controller that I have from Gemini USA different in some way that callibration would be different? Does anyone have an analog controller that is being used with MacMAME, and if so, what are the special steps that I need to follow to callibrate the controller? Or are analog controllers not compatible with MacMAME?
Unless it's a really weird controller, it should be compatible. Let me ask you to have a little patience, because the answers to your questions will all change radically as far as MacMAME goes once I finally shove the next version out the door, which should be hopefully any day now.

Re: (Analog) Joystick Compatibility & Callibration with MAME #20110 11/05/04 12:41 PM
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Integra Offline OP
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I can't get the controller to seem to work though. None of the directional controllers work (stick controllers and the pad at the top left). I am only able to get a few of the buttons to calibrate. I'm starting to think that the controller is not compatible with MacMAME. I haven't tried it with any other applications, though. I purchased it for use with MacMAME.

Re: (Analog) Joystick Compatibility & Callibration with MAME #20111 11/05/04 02:37 PM
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seanraaron Offline
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There are known controller issues with the current version of MacMAME, so if you want a good test I would suggest trying an older version. I use .74u2 myself, so try that and see if you have the same results.


Sean Aaron
Re: (Analog) Joystick Compatibility & Callibration with MAME #20112 11/11/04 12:49 PM
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Integra Offline OP
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Quote:
There are known controller issues with the current version of MacMAME, so if you want a good test I would suggest trying an older version. I use .74u2 myself, so try that and see if you have the same results.
Hmmmm ... after trying the controller with other emulators (SNESX) and other games (Star Wars Episode #1 Racer), I have been able to get the controller to work as it should with those games. I have tried several versions of MacMAME and the problem seems to exist in every version I have tried. I notice .. when I am calibrating the controller, that it will record the same calibration for different movements of the keypad or joystick. I am at least happy now that I know the controller isn't the problem, but still wish it would work with MacMAME ... I purchased the controller to use with MacMAME.

Re: (Analog) Joystick Compatibility & Callibration with MAME #20113 11/11/04 01:52 PM
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seanraaron Offline
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I have the Logitech Dual Wingman with vibro function and don't have any issues. Are you using any other 3rd party drivers like GamePad Companion? The only issues I have with MacMAME pre-.87 is that the right analogue stick cannot be used for digital control and mappings for Start and Select won't stick. Other than that analogue calibration works fine.

I will say that sometimes I have to shut down MacMAME and disconnect/reconnect the controller to have the analogue work properly, but that's usually only after the initial attempt. Give that a try, but again, with the latest version of MacMAME there are known problems with controllers both analogue and digital, so don't expect any result until the next release for that, but do try .77 or .74.

Cheers,

Sean


Sean Aaron
Re: (Analog) Joystick Compatibility & Callibration with MAME #20114 11/12/04 05:51 PM
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Vas Crabb Offline
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I have the Logitech Dual Action Gamepad USB and it works fine with both analog and digital games on MacMAME 0.77u2. The only little issue is that I have to go and assign all the digital directions every time I launch MacMAME. It won't stick.

Re: (Analog) Joystick Compatibility & Callibration with MAME #20115 11/13/04 01:27 AM
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seanraaron Offline
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Huh, I have the reverse, the digital controls stick, but the analogue controls aren't remembered (and neither is the Start button).


Sean Aaron
Re: (Analog) Joystick Compatibility & Callibration with MAME #20116 11/13/04 02:20 AM
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Integra Offline OP
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Hmmm ... well, is this a problem with MacMAME only? I bought the controller for use with MacMAME, and although I have been able to get it to work as it is supposed to with other games, I am disappointed that it doesn't seem to be supported by MacMAME. If the controller will not work with MacMAME, I will probably return it for a refund. This isn't the first controller I've used with MacMAME though ... I bought a Gravis Gamepad Pro ( http://www.hardwarecentral.com/graphics/screenshots/gamepad.gif ) about 3 years ago, and it worked perfectly. The controller I have now is a little more complicated, but I paid the same price for it ($14.95). If there is a compatibility issue with MacMAME and the controller I have, I want to return the controller to the place where it was purchased. I bought the controller thinking I would use it about 95% of the time with MacMAME only.

Re: (Analog) Joystick Compatibility & Callibration with MAME #20117 11/13/04 05:34 AM
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seanraaron Offline
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Personally I've had the best results with a PSX/N-64 converter from Lik-Sang using the High Frequency dual force Playstation pad.

Before you return your pad; I would probably wait for the next update. Brad is planning on re-writing the way MacMAME interfaces with controllers, which should improve things generally for USB HID devices, but I guess that depends on how much patience you have.


Sean Aaron
Re: (Analog) Joystick Compatibility & Callibration with MAME #20118 11/13/04 05:51 AM
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John Hood Offline
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Yes, I was about to suggest the same thing re MacMAME update. It'll be worth the wait smile

Re: (Analog) Joystick Compatibility & Callibration with MAME #20119 11/13/04 09:07 AM
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Integra Offline OP
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From seanraaron:
Quote:
Before you return your pad; I would probably wait for the next update.
I would do this, except I am not sure how soon the next version will be released. I know that MacMAME updates don't appear very frequently. I would guess that the place I purchased it from would frown if I waited very long to return the item. I'm sorry about this topic being so lengthy. I was just really disappointed when I was unable to get the controller to work with MacMAME, especially since I did not have any callibration problems with the previous controller that I bought from Gravis (the Gamepad Pro), because that was the reason I purchased it.

frown

Integra

Re: (Analog) Joystick Compatibility & Callibration with MAME #20120 11/13/04 10:50 AM
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Vas Crabb Offline
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I took my PowerBook to the shop (Myer on Bourke St. Mall) and they let me try all the different controllers out to see if they worked with my emulators, and whether I liked them. I'd recommend anyone else do the same before buying a game pad.

Re: (Analog) Joystick Compatibility & Callibration with MAME #20121 11/13/04 11:56 AM
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Integra Offline OP
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I guess I wasn't aware that MacMAME was only compatible with certain controllers. frown This explains why my Gravis Gamepad Pro works, but the new controller I have now doesn't. A question I have is ... is there a place that lists the controllers that are compatible with MacMAME, and that recommends what controllers to use with MacMAME? This would help anyone that is making a decision about which controller to buy, and let them know whether the controller they are considering is compatible with MacMAME or not. A list that shows what controllers are compatible with MacMAME would have saved me some frustration and disappointment as well. I thought all USB controllers were the same ... now, I know they are not.

Re: (Analog) Joystick Compatibility & Callibration with MAME #20122 11/13/04 08:35 PM
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Vas Crabb Offline
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The trouble with supporting USB HID controllers is that there are so many possibilities. The HID spec. gives a lot of freedom. Think of the start button. Pretty simple, huh? But it can be reported as a button, or a start control. It can have an arbitrary on value that could be anything the manufacturer likes.

Or what about an eight-direction d-pad? You'd probably report it as a hat switch. But what units do you give? My Logitech reports a physical minimum of 0 and maximum of 7 corresponding to a logical minimum of 0 and maximum of 315 in units of degrees. It reports a physical value of 8 for the neutral position (out of range). But you could report values in degrees directly, or use some other arbitrary range of physical values.

Analog axes are even more fun. You can report them as the X, Y, Z, Rx, Ry and Rz axes, or as vectors, or as many of the things on the simulation controls page, in any units you want, with all kinds of physical and logical ranges.

It's a lot of work to try to support all the possibilities. Apple's HID utilities library attempts to help. However, it's quite inflexible, and can cause problems. For instance, it completely screws up the value from the d-pad on my Logitech. It isn't really fair to expect any piece of software to support every USB HID controller.

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