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Re: Microvision [Re: Lord Nightmare] #25172
12/02/06 08:29 AM
12/02/06 08:29 AM
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ranger_lennier Offline
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I'm glad to hear someone's interested in these chips. I'm of course interested in the Microvision. What else were they used for? The patent I linked to earlier is the best description I've seen of the test mode, though several patents reference the TMS1000 series of chips. One interesting patent is 4270755 , which actually lists the ROM contents for a TMS1100 used in an electronic game. At one point I searched an academic database for the TMS1000 and TMS1100 and found lots of references, but since most of them didn't have full text available, I'm not sure if there's anything useful there.

Would it help if I made a scan of the "TMS 1000 Series Data Manual?" It doesn't mention the test mode so far as I can see, but perhaps there's some useful information in there.

Do you think decapsulation would make the dumping easy? Microvision games aren't all that rare, so I wouldn't object to this if it worked.

Originally Posted By Lord Nightmare
If anyone knows the deep dark secret test mode for extracting the data from a TMS1000, TMS1001, TMS1002, or TMS1100 (or any TI microcontrollers for that matter) PLEASE share it! I'm just beginning work on a project which requires a TMS1001 (or maybe its a 1002) to be dumped, and I REALLY don't want to have to decapsulate it (and destroy it in the process) to do so.

Lord Nightmare

Re: Microvision [Re: ranger_lennier] #25173
12/02/06 09:42 AM
12/02/06 09:42 AM
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judge Offline
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Originally Posted By ranger_lennier


Would it help if I made a scan of the "TMS 1000 Series Data Manual?" It doesn't mention the test mode so far as I can see, but perhaps there's some useful information in there.



Any info is welcome I guess; I wouldn't mind putting in some time to build some kind of mess cpu core for this project (even if I don't understand the cpu just yet wink )

Re: Microvision [Re: judge] #25175
12/02/06 03:00 PM
12/02/06 03:00 PM
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Knarfian Offline
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Hey - I think maybe you can dump the TMS1000 series after all!

If you look in that patent that ranger_lennier cited (#3988604), they describe a "KC" pin which can be used to enable test mode.

Well, it's clear to me that this is actually the INIT (or RESET) pin on the actual part. They even talk about it being used for power on clear.

If the patent is actually implemented this way, you can hold the chip in reset, clock in some address locations, and get the ROM data out. Very cool!


Re: Microvision [Re: Heihachi_73] #25207
12/04/06 06:20 AM
12/04/06 06:20 AM
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Posts: 1,986
Sydney, Australia
Vas Crabb Offline
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Originally Posted By Heihachi_73
LOL, may I ask how on earth you got that! Although, aren't they just a PC based machine - I have seen a National teller with a very Windows NT style BSOD on it.


It isn't a PC. It's an old dedicated terminal, from before PCs made it into those places. It was made by Burroughs in the early to mid '80s. It has an integrated card reader and 5" green screen. It had an integrated printer until its previous owner stole it. The previous owner has told me that the CPU is a 6811 and the video chip is a MC6845. I still haven't taken the thing apart or tried dumping it, simply because I don't have the time.

Why does everyone assume that every archaic device I get my hands on is a PC of some kind??? Do my posts make me seem too stupid to know the difference???

Re: Microvision [Re: ranger_lennier] #25217
12/04/06 09:16 AM
12/04/06 09:16 AM
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danlboris Offline
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According to this site:

http://www.old-computers.com/museum/computer.asp?c=1053&st=1

the TMS1100 was used in Science Fair Microcomputer Trainer, and also in the Speak and Spell.

That manual you mention would probably be very useful. I have been researching this chip also and the only things I have found on the net about it are the pinouts and the basic specs.

Dan


Originally Posted By ranger_lennier
I'm glad to hear someone's interested in these chips. I'm of course interested in the Microvision. What else were they used for? The patent I linked to earlier is the best description I've seen of the test mode, though several patents reference the TMS1000 series of chips. One interesting patent is 4270755 , which actually lists the ROM contents for a TMS1100 used in an electronic game. At one point I searched an academic database for the TMS1000 and TMS1100 and found lots of references, but since most of them didn't have full text available, I'm not sure if there's anything useful there.

Would it help if I made a scan of the "TMS 1000 Series Data Manual?" It doesn't mention the test mode so far as I can see, but perhaps there's some useful information in there.

Do you think decapsulation would make the dumping easy? Microvision games aren't all that rare, so I wouldn't object to this if it worked.

Originally Posted By Lord Nightmare
If anyone knows the deep dark secret test mode for extracting the data from a TMS1000, TMS1001, TMS1002, or TMS1100 (or any TI microcontrollers for that matter) PLEASE share it! I'm just beginning work on a project which requires a TMS1001 (or maybe its a 1002) to be dumped, and I REALLY don't want to have to decapsulate it (and destroy it in the process) to do so.

Lord Nightmare

Re: Microvision [Re: danlboris] #25244
12/05/06 09:53 AM
12/05/06 09:53 AM
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Posts: 513
Kentucky
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ranger_lennier Offline
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I see that the TMS1000 was used in the Big Trak.

http://www.robotroom.com/BigTrak.html

OK, I made some 300 dpi scans of the TMS data book. The interior is black and white, so file sizes were reasonable. The cover is color, so file sizes were not. I've exported those as JPEG and packed everything into a ZIP file.

http://ranger.mameworld.info/tms_1000_series_data_manual.zip

It wouldn't hurt to clean everything up into a PDF file or something. If anyone volunteers, I can host it. And if anyone wants the high quality cover scans, let me know and I'll put them on-line and send a link.

There seems to be a lack of pictures of the Microvision in action, so I made a couple. Games are simple, but some are rather fun. Really it's best to see it in motion, so I might try to make a video at some point.

http://ranger.mameworld.info/vegas_slots.jpg

http://ranger.mameworld.info/pinball.jpg

Hopefully the information in the data book along with the patent will be sufficient for emulation work. Be sure to check out the patent images. The US Patent Office website's image viewing is seriously deficient, so I went ahead and downloaded the patent images and packed them together.

http://ranger.mameworld.info/patent_3988604.zip

I hope this helps. Keep us posted on the progress everyone, and when/if the time comes, I can send out some Microvision carts for dumping.

Re: Microvision [Re: ranger_lennier] #25247
12/05/06 12:26 PM
12/05/06 12:26 PM
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 500
Bradford, UK
incog Offline
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The fragility of the keypads and the screen-rot that wikipedia mention are very noticeable in those pictures.

Is your offer to scan the Supervision handhelds still up? I've heard quite a few different models exist and I want to get started on a real Mess artwork project. The new Mame artwork project is inspiring.

(sorry if none of this makes sense, it's 4:30am and i cant sleep)

Re: Microvision [Re: ranger_lennier] #25250
12/05/06 04:21 PM
12/05/06 04:21 PM
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 207
SF Bay Area, CA, USA
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tlindner Offline
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Ranger_lennier, I took your tiffs of the data manual and made a PDF. Grab it here:

TMS1000 Data Manual


tim lindner
tlindner@macmess.org
Re: Microvision [Re: tlindner] #25254
12/05/06 10:39 PM
12/05/06 10:39 PM
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 1,019
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hap Offline OP
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Thanks for doing those TMS scans ranger_lennier.
As for seeing the games in motion, you can download a 1-game-simulator on this German forum: http://www.aep-emu.de/index.php?name=PNphpBB2&file=viewtopic&t=3802

Re: Microvision [Re: hap] #25265
12/06/06 08:07 AM
12/06/06 08:07 AM
Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 1,170
Vancouver Island, BC, Canada
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Justin Online content
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For compressing scanned manuals, I recommend the DjVu file format: http://interbutt.com/temp/tms_1000_series_data_manual.djvu (751KB)
The results might be slightly better if the original high-quality scans were used (i.e. before conversion to JPEG and two-tone TIFF).

There's an online converter here and a browser plugin here.

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