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Re: mame with zinc plugin support has been released #9119
06/19/04 12:41 AM
06/19/04 12:41 AM
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Lillymon Offline
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Lillymon  Offline
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As you've probably guessed, I knew about this already and have been messing around with it. While there are still some flaws in the set-up, it works for the most part. The only emulation flaws (lack of music, random lock-ups) happen on regular MAME too and would be fixed anyway.

As with smf, I don't get what his problem is. It violates the MAME license because it could be used with something that's not source available or open source? I'd think he'd be willing to take that to keep hardware reanderers out of the main MAME project.

Re: mame with zinc plugin support has been released #9120
06/19/04 02:27 AM
06/19/04 02:27 AM
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R. Belmont Offline
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smf's main problem appears to be that he feels he's not getting any recognition for his (quite outstanding) work on the PSX hardware core and drivers. A lot of that has to do with the fact that everyone's already used to playing many of the games in ZiNc, so all of the things MAME does above and beyond just hacking stuff so the games will work is only apparent to folks like myself, Pete, and OG. Nobody cares about perfect SIO emulation or cycle-accurate DMA, because Rival Schools runs the same either way. (I'm expecting all that kind of "background" work to become more obvious when I hookup the CD-ROM emulation in MESS - I'll be surprised if compatibility isn't outstanding right off the bat).

As far as the license thing, I'm not convinced it's any more of a license violation than MAMEW itself is - after all, it hard-links to some of the most-closed source DLLs on the planet (DirectX), and unlike the DX stuff the plugins are optional (I assume there's still some way to use the built-ins).

Re: mame with zinc plugin support has been released #9121
06/19/04 03:35 AM
06/19/04 03:35 AM
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R. Belmont Offline
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Incidentally, it seems that ZiNc itself is "old and busted" now. I saw on one site I won't name where it was brought up. The first reply was "screw that, there's Chankast". Then someone posted 8 times in a row demanding Tekken Tag. I know a game I'm not gonna be investigating any time soon...

Re: mame with zinc plugin support has been released #9122
06/19/04 04:00 AM
06/19/04 04:00 AM
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Shogetsu Offline
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Well, I know I'm not some important person nor something similar... but I really appreaciate the work smf does, and I always love to see his improvements on the PSX emulation (both MAME and MESS), I don't care if Zinc is faster... as far as it concerns me emulation isn't just playing.

Re: mame with zinc plugin support has been released #9123
06/19/04 04:18 AM
06/19/04 04:18 AM
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Lillymon Offline
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Quote:
smf's main problem appears to be that he feels he's not getting any recognition for his (quite outstanding) work on the PSX hardware core and drivers.
You've got me on that one. I find it hard to care without any end results. It's particularly hard to care right now since ZiNc is better at playing the games than MAME is.
Quote:
A lot of that has to do with the fact that everyone's already used to playing many of the games in ZiNc, so all of the things MAME does above and beyond just hacking stuff so the games will work is only apparent to folks like myself, Pete, and OG. Nobody cares about perfect SIO emulation or cycle-accurate DMA, because Rival Schools runs the same either way.
Got that right on. But it's unfair to expect any more from someone who just likes playing games and can't even program in Basic.
Quote:
(I assume there's still some way to use the built-ins).
Actually, you have to use the built-in software renderers if you want to configure the controls (the menu won't appear on the additional ZiNc window that appears). The game also has to be in 'low-res' mode for it to be possible to even see anything of the menu. It gets big time corrupted once the game goes into 'high-res' mode. At least for me.
Quote:
Incidentally, it seems that ZiNc itself is "old and busted" now. I saw on one site I won't name where it was brought up. The first reply was "screw that, there's Chankast".
Heh, he does have a point though.

Seriously though, although I would like to see ZiNc 1.0 released, EK-MAME Plus! will make it obsolete if a version is released where MAME is 'fixed up' somewhat. I got speed increases using the ZiNc GPU and SPU plugins with EK-MAME Plus! that I didn't think possible. Constant 60FPS in Strider 2? How can I not be excited?!?
Quote:
Then someone posted 8 times in a row demanding Tekken Tag. I know a game I'm not gonna be investigating any time soon...
8 times in a row? Now that's a championship idiot. Tekken Tag Tournament is one game I'd like to play to see how the arcade version compares to the PlayStation 2 version. Of course, it's no biggie. I could just find and buy the PS2 port. Or find somewhere to download a pirated copy. Whichever is easier.

Re: mame with zinc plugin support has been released #9124
06/19/04 06:19 AM
06/19/04 06:19 AM
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BrianT Offline
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Well... as much as I respect the work of all Devs (especialy MAMEDev's) I checked out the modded Mame. It's got a ton of issues... The way it's hacked together breaks many things. Cool Boarders bombs on Z80 failure, Crypte Killers as SPU ram issues... no music in Star Gladiator (the q-sound seems to be off). I couldn't get anything to run full screen... blah blah blah

Granted, it did look nice for those games that did run. I get about 75% with an Athlon 3000+ in Mame and mostly 60/60 with the hacked it Zinc stuff.

But I think everyone knew this kind of "addition" to Mame was coming.

I'd love to Mame with a DRC PSX core running at full speed 3D or no 3D. Of course the longer ZiNc v1.0 takes to come out the more this type of thing is going to happen. Though with DC/Naomi emulation you may get the kiddies to look away and quit nagging :-)

I guess you have to take the good with the bad.

RB: Any luck getting Heaven's Gate sound up and running? And what's the final on the 11 rom, cut it or not?

Re: mame with zinc plugin support has been released #9125
06/19/04 06:23 AM
06/19/04 06:23 AM
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Maagic Offline
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"Old and busted"? I think not, hacked and modular, yes, but thats ok, because as far as I know, Zinc's purpose is not accurate emulation, its improving speed and viuals. What you've done with zinc is truely state of the art, in a hardware sense. I think the reaction it prompted with the "kiddies" may be overshadowing the real achievement.

Zinc has a place right next to mame, because they both do very different things, and using zinc components in mame is contradictory to everything mame stands for, not to mention, this couldn't have come at a worse time. Although I suppose it is a naural reaction to "final zinc".

I dont think development on zinc should stop because of this, I think it should continue in spite of it. Besides, if RB and Pete make zinc pretty enough, maybe the kiddies will leave poor naomi alone.


Just ignore me.
Re: mame with zinc plugin support has been released #9126
06/19/04 06:42 AM
06/19/04 06:42 AM
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Posts: 16,163
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R. Belmont Offline
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Nobody's stopping ZiNc. At least, not more than we were going to previously. Mheh.

Incidentally, the PEOpS SPU oughta support ZiNc now too. Then only the accelerated renderers will be evil (and I'm assuming given the general slow death of PS1 emulation that they'll be PEOpS'ed soon enough anyway).

Re: mame with zinc plugin support has been released #9127
06/19/04 10:42 AM
06/19/04 10:42 AM
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 57
Moscow, Russia
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Flash Offline
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Moscow, Russia
Quote:
Originally posted by R. Belmont:
As far as the license thing, I'm not convinced it's any more of a license violation than MAMEW itself is - after all, it hard-links to some of the most-closed source DLLs on the planet (DirectX), and unlike the DX stuff the plugins are optional (I assume there's still some way to use the built-ins). [/QB]
Yep. Of course you can use internal plugins.

P.S. I really like to play DOA++ and Fighting Layer
@1600x1200x32 w/4xFSAA (thanks to great Lewpy's plugin smile


System specs: Linux (2.6.29.4), A64 X2 5400+, 6Gb RAM, Quadro FX 5600.
Re: mame with zinc plugin support has been released #9128
06/19/04 11:14 AM
06/19/04 11:14 AM
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 57
Moscow, Russia
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Flash Offline
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Moscow, Russia
Quote:
Originally posted by BrianT:
Well... as much as I respect the work of all Devs (especialy MAMEDev's) I checked out the modded Mame. It's got a ton of issues... The way it's hacked together breaks many things. Cool Boarders bombs on Z80 failure
Really ? But it works. Use your brain instead of (brute)force, Luke laugh laugh laugh
How about disable zinc spu and use internal ?
Sound hardware of this game is not emulated in old
Zinc SPU plugin...

No music in Star Gladiator (the q-sound seems to be off).
And where's the music in official MAME ?
I can't hear it... laugh
Quote:
I couldn't get anything to run full screen... blah blah blah
You can't but i can, and i pretty sure everyone else here can smile How about to edit renderer.cfg ?


System specs: Linux (2.6.29.4), A64 X2 5400+, 6Gb RAM, Quadro FX 5600.
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